Curse

Talesin Darkbriar · Jun 24, 2005, 11:26 PM // 23:26

How many times have you read:

"GW Economy is trashed"
"We need a server wipe"
"This game is over!"
"PvE/PvP is totally unbalanced"

These subjects and more are all authored by (often) well meaning folks who have played the game for sometime and are now incensed by a "streaming" patch change.

This article seeks to address a few common and persistent delusions:

Myth #1: The Economy is ruined

Game economies always come down to the simple supply and demand mantra.
If you want it, and are willing to pay any price for it, you will soon be seperated from your coin.

There is a palpable attitude in Tyria that its population wants everything served to them on a silver platter - NOW.
This is childish.
Consider, you have the same chance of acquiring any item you desire by simply putting in the TIME and EFFORT to acquire it.
Farmers gamble on your impatience and seek to maximize their profits on such.

ANet has come right out from the start and stated that 15k armors are no more functional than 1.5k armors; and many more items are similarly nothing more than a gold sink.
If you have the coins, fantastic! spend at will, but the game is not one iota unbalanced, ruined, or oterhwise broken because farmer_00012 won't sell you "uber733t-looking sword_01" for less than 500k gp.
That's the reality of it.

Myth #2: PvE / PvP is unbalanced.

So many of us hail from a colorful history of "other" online games. We know painfully well what "Unbalanced" is, and the "reality" is that Guild Wars is the most evenly balanced game to date - ever.

There does not exist a single "uber" class combination, (Although you are welcome to forever look for one) and the "perception" of what is really happening is; "My "Ultimate" class combo got "owned hard" by a different class...INCONCEIVABLE!

So with all the logic befitting the average 11 year old, we are spammed with post after post of how hideously unfair class x is versus class z.

The game is called GUILD WARS. This title assumes teamwork, cooperation, strategy and tactics. The different classes are nothing more than "style" approaches to how you play the game.

A wise player tries them all, learns the strengths and weaknesses of each, and then seeks to capitalize on such during battle. Most of us understand the basic rock - paper - scissors triad of destiny...but for those who do not, they come here and spew their bile about how their uber Warrior/Monk got owned hard by an unarmored Air Elementalist!
Dwayna Forbid! How IS that possible?
I realize you get my point...

Myth #3: The Game is over at level 20.

For those who have not yet reached that point, the opposite is true. The game "begins" at this point. Level cap does not equal endgame here.
Am I crazy? Take a stroll into the underground or fissure of woe for some painful reality checks.

Level 20 is when you can finally chase down and acquire the most rare, sought after and drooled over pieces of gear in Tyria. Bring plenty of friends, because you will definitely need them.
Don't have any friends or a guild?
Now's the time to start looking - check the forums here, many excellent guilds are available.

For those of you illustrious enough to have already defeated these fell places, I implore you to create a new class combo and try again - recent changes to the game have made it quite a bit harder than the initial time through.
I am becoming painfully aware of this myself.

Myth #4: GW doesn't have the "things" mandatory in every other game!

This is the farming, grinding, and kill-stealing crew. These sad folks have played with these mandatory deficiencies for so long that they are now perceived as "normal" and anything otherwise is "wrong."

Reality is the opposite.
"The game lacks a social element" is the common refrain; which unfortunately is also loosely translated as;
"I have no one to run trains over, kill steal, or just grief while out farming and looking for trouble."
I realize not everyone does this, but the majority do. GW challenges you to change up your social skills along with your playing ones: You can freely socialize in any mission, city or town zone.
The freedom to socialize has not been compromised in the slightest, the ability to do so in a negative fashion has been removed.

Aye, I met some of my best friends in online games in the wilderness of the Dreadlands, or out deep in Hibernia, but the possibility of meeting new faces is still just as great - but you must do it before the adventure is all.

It really comes down to this:
The Naysayers don't want any change - period. They are happy with the tried, true, and broken caveats of past games.
These are thrown aside for what they are - anachronisms.
In this respect, Guild Wars is revolutionary in its approach to the genre.

Please add anything I've missed!
Respectfully yours,

Talesin

Loviatar · Jun 24, 2005, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

Please add anything I've missed!
Respectfully yours,

Talesin

THANK YOU

PieXags · Jun 24, 2005, 11:43 PM // 23:43

Me thinks I've made a new friend.

Genos · Jun 24, 2005, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Very, very nice post.

Winter King · Jun 24, 2005, 11:47 PM // 23:47

I'd also like to add that a number of arguments supporting the perceptions here are logically unsound; based on questionable experiences, straw men, and the dismissable of any contrary view point in place of discussion.

I appreciate this post, especially after having read through many of the other threads on this page.

Ian · Jun 24, 2005, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Well said. You may have spoken for the silent majority.

stumpy · Jun 25, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

it is true ... i have read many posts in the past week such as (example) the KCHS spirit spam that won the hoh being unfair, air elementalists bragging about ownage, many others that implore a lack of maturity and narrow vision to the game. Lets not even dare bring up the unbalanced side of pvp players that want everything handed to them on a silver platter or the pve player who is tired of doing the missions over and over again. Many of the updates have increased the value of an already good game. More are yet to come, but in the meanwhile ... the unfortunate truth is that there will always be someone crying about something because you can never please all of the people. Even more unfortunate is that they seemingly find guru the place to spam it.

lol ... i feel bad for the moderators who have to deal with these people and if i have ever been in that position i appologize. nice words ... hope it gets a sticky slapped on you!

EmperorTippy · Jun 25, 2005, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Excellent post. This is two in a row that I agree with you on. You sure you havent been replaced? Maybe your just changing or I am beginng to change(not really).

ManadartheHealer · Jun 25, 2005, 02:06 AM // 02:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winter King

...a number of arguments supporting the perceptions here are logically unsound; based on questionable experiences, straw men, and the dismissable of any contrary view point in place of discussion.

I appreciate this post, especially after having read through many of the other threads on this page.

That pretty much sums up my opinion as well. /cheers

Deathlord · Jun 25, 2005, 02:10 AM // 02:10

Unfortunately if there are myth's concerning these areas, then the post has no real value except putting some thoughts into word form. You can teach a kid how to read and show him this website, he'll probably still learn nothing. Informative I suppose, but those who bother to accept this probably shared this point of view from the beggining anyway.
(Btw, don't take this offensively, the post is great, just unfortunately it's too true)

termite · Jun 25, 2005, 02:57 AM // 02:57

Too long, so I won't bother reading it. After all, these are just "myths"...

Zeru · Jun 25, 2005, 02:58 AM // 02:58

I doubt most of those who believe or spread these 'myths' would even read this though

shinseikaze · Jun 25, 2005, 05:31 AM // 05:31

well spoken

5월 제일 팀 승리

Ollj · Jun 25, 2005, 05:42 AM // 05:42

nicely cleared up myths.

sino-soviet · Jun 25, 2005, 06:25 AM // 06:25

Thank you for the economy part. I would even go so far as to say there is NO economic problem.

Wa$d · Jun 25, 2005, 06:34 AM // 06:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by sino-soviet

Thank you for the economy part. I would even go so far as to say there is NO economic problem.

Well No economic problem is pushing it, that would be like saying Iraq had no Weapons of mass destruction, depending who you belive and vote for.....well thats my political reference for the night /night all

Sandman Uk · Jun 25, 2005, 06:37 AM // 06:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

Myth #3: The Game is over at level 20.

For those who have not yet reached that point, the opposite is true. The game "begins" at this point. Level cap does not equal endgame here.
Am I crazy? Take a stroll into the underground or fissure of woe for some painful reality checks.

Taking a stroll for a lvl 20 in Europe isnt as easy as your making out. Firstly Europe has to have the favour. I would love to see the official stats on ownership. I think it would read

Usa 45%
Korea 45%
Europe 10%

Dont get me wrong on this post you are correct.

But start breaking down the posters who are happy and who complain down into their territories. Americans and koreans probably dont see it from a Europeans side of a LvL 20 who has completed all the missions and quests and they are at the end of the game.

Of the happy % of the European posters you can bet ya bottom dollar they have quests and missions still to do.

Someone will now reply "Go to the halls and Win then". Again I would like to see stats on how many times a PVE team thats been created at the Tombs has won against a PVP guild created in PVP in the HoH. (Putting my head on the chopping block and assuming that PVP/PVE all clash in there)

I have tried forming a team in the Tombs gone in with a team you have spent 20 mins recruiting and then met up with the Sissy Boys or We gamer and not even come close to denting their PVP full guild teams using that are all using Team speak.

PVE V PVP Balanced I think not

Not sure if this is fair on average Joe PVE but thats another post in the making.

If it wasnt for Fissure/Underworld to keep me going now I have completed the initial part of the game I would have given up on such a wonderfull game. But waiting for the 10% ownwership to be able to enter can even get boring.

dragonyy · Jun 25, 2005, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

How many times have you read:

This article seeks to address a few common and persistent delusions:

Myth #1: The Economy is ruined

Game economies always come down to the simple supply and demand mantra.
If you want it, and are willing to pay any price for it, you will soon be seperated from your coin.

Talesin

One thing you must not forget, in the game there is an unlimited supply of currency, gold. The more players kill, the more gold gets into the economy, which quickly raises inflation. In real life, there are ways to control the creation of money. So unless the developpers imposes taxes, or ways to force money out of the system, the economy of GW is flawed from the start.

wheel · Jun 25, 2005, 08:08 AM // 08:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragonyy

One thing you must not forget, in the game there is an unlimited supply of currency, gold. The more players kill, the more gold gets into the economy, which quickly raises inflation. In real life, there are ways to control the creation of money. So unless the developpers imposes taxes, or ways to force money out of the system, the economy of GW is flawed from the start.

great post :-)

they need to make more money sinks so that players will want to plop down money on NPCs instead of just give players money.

fissure armor is great and all, costing total about 500-600k, but most of that money stays in the economy with players selling obsidian shards and gobs of ectoplasm. only 75k per armor set gets eaten up by the NPC.

experience scrolls are good too for a money sink, and my favorite money sink of all time, dwarven ale, has eaten up at least 20k of my gold. :-P

john little · Jun 25, 2005, 10:06 AM // 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman Uk

But start breaking down the posters who are happy and who complain down into their territories. Americans and koreans probably dont see it from a Europeans side of a LvL 20 who has completed all the missions and quests and they are at the end of the game.

The challenge is for europe to start producing quality guilds. At the moment there are far too many european guilds with less than 8 members, and the current system makes analysing the 'form' of guilds very difficult (especially as fewer wins in HoH means fewer sigils and so fewer guilds with halls competing in GvG).

I like the fact that the high end PvE is dependant on success in PvP, I think it does a lot to make PvE players respect successful PvP players. Hopefully in the future there can be PvE that affects PvP in a similar way.

I don't have a problem with the economy, if players want to spend thousands of gold on items that do +1 damage, fair play to them. I don't think that moaning that you can't afford that +1 is in any way productive and can't change unless you completely remove gold from the game - something that would undermine the RPG/progression aspect.